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penpusherContinuing with my series of posts about the behind the scenes of how telemarketing works, there are a few other elements that are worth noting when it comes to dealing with a situation where you are called.
Not every telemarketing company works exactly the same way. Some companies have bots that call you with recorded messages. Others are shysters who are really looking to scam money from you. Those aren't really telemarketing companies at all; those are criminals. And then there are companies that are working at very low levels, trying to get you to donate five or ten dollars for some cause.
My company is one of the highest regarded and well respected firms in the business. We have done work for a lot of very well known clients and have been hired back again and again by many, including Carnegie Hall (which just started their Spring campaign this week), American Ballet Theatre Subscriptions (we're just wrapping up the renewals for the 2014 season before tickets go on sale to the general public), and the many times aforementioned Democratic National Committee. They might love us more than we love them!
Part of the reason my company has had the success it achieved is through the method used to train our callers.
There is something of an industry standard when it comes to training people for this work. Typically, callers begin with a script that tells them what the client wants them to say to these potential donors. But, let's face it. When someone is reading to you, not talking, you know it and it sounds exactly like what it is: a person reading. That's part of the negative element that people cite when talking about why they don't like telemarketing calls. Of course, the image of someone reading a script is enough to make you hang up the phone, even if you aren't talking on it!
Personally, I hate scripts with a passion! Typically they are written by someone in the client's office, and that person usually doesn't know anything about "writing for the ear." Yes, there is a technique of presenting information to a person on the telephone, and that is different from writing for a person to read on their own.
So the idea that many of the top callers in the business and I use is to read the script before we get on the phone, figure out what the important points are, the message the client wants out there, and then turn that into something we would say. It's very important to make it personal, to say the message the way you would say it. Then it becomes more real, and then it becomes something coming from you, a real person.
We want to engage our patrons, to have an actual conversation with them. So anything we can do to be able to converse with the people we call is a positive.
Now, on to the title of the topic: How Many Nos? Often when a telemarketer calls you, (and you decide to actually listen to what they are saying at that moment) they will thank you for your previous support, make their opening pitch, remind you of how important this is and ask you for a dollar figure amount. This amount is not out of thin air. It actually is three times the amount of the highest previous contribution you had ever made to that client.
In other words, if you had donated 2500 dollars to the DNC in one shot in the Spring of 2012, maybe donated another 1000 right before the presidential election, and donated 50 dollars last year, we would still ask you for 7500 dollars when we called you, today. Never mind that you obviously were donating to help President Obama's re-election efforts, then. (And actually, I ask slightly differently, but I'll get to that in a moment.)
So there it is! We just asked you for seventy-five hundred dollars.
Some people say "No!" and immediately hang up at that point. That's probably a mistake because typically, we are instructed to ask a patron three times for some sort of support. So it's possible that someone may call again in a week or two to follow up.
The first ask is where the call really begins. And that first ask is there to serve a couple of points. Since it's 3 times the biggest single amount the patron had previously given, we know it's not extremely likely they will give it. It's an "icebreaker ask," or a place to start the negotiations, and really, for that reason, it has to be a high amount. If it isn't high to start, we have no place to go!
Of course, if they say yes, then WOW! We just got that person to give 3 times the most they ever gave! But typically the patron will either be indignant that we asked for such an extravagant amount or will start laughing hysterically that we think they would ever consider giving that kind of scratch.
The second ask is always preceded by more information and different information about the organization, the work they are doing and other elements to help justify what's happening. And the second ask is typically twice the largest previous donation. So going back to our DNC supporter, that's going to be 5000 bucks.
All the previous rules apply in this second ask. Again, it's still double what the biggest gift that person ever gave in a single donation. So, again, not extremely likely they'll give that amount. But it's always a possibility, so we ask thinking there could be a chance it'll happen.
If we get another no, we again follow up apologizing for asking for so much, and conclude with whatever points haven't been made, or a reiteration of the most important elements of what we were talking about and remind the patron that they donated 2500 dollars just a couple of years ago. Would they help us by doing that again?
Personally, I like to double and double on my asks. If the patron donated 2500 dollars, I start at 10K, which is doubling the two times contribution. 10K, 5K, 2,500. It makes it neater, it's easier to say ten thousand dollars than seventy-five hundred dollars, and it's a bigger amount! We don't necessarily expect the patron to give that first ask amount... it's there to make the other asks seem a little more reasonable.
Additionally, the telemarketer that's calling you has been instructed not to make the call "an auction."
"You don't want to give 2,500 dollars? Then how about two thousand? Can you make it fifteen hundred? C'mon! I know you must have a thousand dollars for us!"
That's another pet peeve that patrons have about the process... constantly trying to find a number and badgering a person until they give something.
Some cagey patrons will, after we ask for ten thousand will say something like, "I won't give that but I'll give you three hundred dollars." And some of the lesser experienced telemarketers will say, "Great!" and take that amount. If you get that response, you know you're dealing with a rank amateur!
We are set to bring the conversation back to the three asks we are supposed to do, at their proper levels. So, if I get a patron who tries that move, I would thank them for the offer but remind them the need and the work that is involved in the effort and go back to the proper level ask to continue. I have lost 300, 500 and sometimes 1000 dollar sales for this, because the patron is offended that we are still asking for more than they have already offered, and they hang up. But this is what the client wants.
Now, if we get to utter our three asks and the patron still wishes to donate that 300 dollars, at that point, we would accept it graciously! But we have to at least get our asks in before settling for a smaller amount.
If the patron still doesn't want to donate after we asked for those three amounts, we have done our job! We typically thank them for taking a moment to speak with us, read any disclaimer that needs to be stated at the end of the call, and wish them a good morning/afternoon/evening. And you won't hear from us again for at least three months or more, depending on what campaign it is. Some of these fundraising efforts are annually, others like the DNC are seasonal (unless you give the maximum per calendar year - currently $32,400.00. In that case, you won't hear from us again until at least January 2nd of the following year!)
At my firm, all of our calls are recorded (and we tell our patrons so at the beginning of the call) and our clients often want to hear our calls to see if we are following their instructions, treating these people nicely, and doing our jobs properly. This is especially true for the DNC, which is held to a very high standard of protocol when it comes to asking patrons for funds. The DNC watches us intently, but we haven't disappointed them yet!
But there's your answer: a telemarketer will likely ask you three times for three separate donation amounts, before the end of the call!
Not every telemarketing company works exactly the same way. Some companies have bots that call you with recorded messages. Others are shysters who are really looking to scam money from you. Those aren't really telemarketing companies at all; those are criminals. And then there are companies that are working at very low levels, trying to get you to donate five or ten dollars for some cause.
My company is one of the highest regarded and well respected firms in the business. We have done work for a lot of very well known clients and have been hired back again and again by many, including Carnegie Hall (which just started their Spring campaign this week), American Ballet Theatre Subscriptions (we're just wrapping up the renewals for the 2014 season before tickets go on sale to the general public), and the many times aforementioned Democratic National Committee. They might love us more than we love them!
Part of the reason my company has had the success it achieved is through the method used to train our callers.
There is something of an industry standard when it comes to training people for this work. Typically, callers begin with a script that tells them what the client wants them to say to these potential donors. But, let's face it. When someone is reading to you, not talking, you know it and it sounds exactly like what it is: a person reading. That's part of the negative element that people cite when talking about why they don't like telemarketing calls. Of course, the image of someone reading a script is enough to make you hang up the phone, even if you aren't talking on it!
Personally, I hate scripts with a passion! Typically they are written by someone in the client's office, and that person usually doesn't know anything about "writing for the ear." Yes, there is a technique of presenting information to a person on the telephone, and that is different from writing for a person to read on their own.
So the idea that many of the top callers in the business and I use is to read the script before we get on the phone, figure out what the important points are, the message the client wants out there, and then turn that into something we would say. It's very important to make it personal, to say the message the way you would say it. Then it becomes more real, and then it becomes something coming from you, a real person.
We want to engage our patrons, to have an actual conversation with them. So anything we can do to be able to converse with the people we call is a positive.
Now, on to the title of the topic: How Many Nos? Often when a telemarketer calls you, (and you decide to actually listen to what they are saying at that moment) they will thank you for your previous support, make their opening pitch, remind you of how important this is and ask you for a dollar figure amount. This amount is not out of thin air. It actually is three times the amount of the highest previous contribution you had ever made to that client.
In other words, if you had donated 2500 dollars to the DNC in one shot in the Spring of 2012, maybe donated another 1000 right before the presidential election, and donated 50 dollars last year, we would still ask you for 7500 dollars when we called you, today. Never mind that you obviously were donating to help President Obama's re-election efforts, then. (And actually, I ask slightly differently, but I'll get to that in a moment.)
So there it is! We just asked you for seventy-five hundred dollars.
Some people say "No!" and immediately hang up at that point. That's probably a mistake because typically, we are instructed to ask a patron three times for some sort of support. So it's possible that someone may call again in a week or two to follow up.
The first ask is where the call really begins. And that first ask is there to serve a couple of points. Since it's 3 times the biggest single amount the patron had previously given, we know it's not extremely likely they will give it. It's an "icebreaker ask," or a place to start the negotiations, and really, for that reason, it has to be a high amount. If it isn't high to start, we have no place to go!
Of course, if they say yes, then WOW! We just got that person to give 3 times the most they ever gave! But typically the patron will either be indignant that we asked for such an extravagant amount or will start laughing hysterically that we think they would ever consider giving that kind of scratch.
The second ask is always preceded by more information and different information about the organization, the work they are doing and other elements to help justify what's happening. And the second ask is typically twice the largest previous donation. So going back to our DNC supporter, that's going to be 5000 bucks.
All the previous rules apply in this second ask. Again, it's still double what the biggest gift that person ever gave in a single donation. So, again, not extremely likely they'll give that amount. But it's always a possibility, so we ask thinking there could be a chance it'll happen.
If we get another no, we again follow up apologizing for asking for so much, and conclude with whatever points haven't been made, or a reiteration of the most important elements of what we were talking about and remind the patron that they donated 2500 dollars just a couple of years ago. Would they help us by doing that again?
Personally, I like to double and double on my asks. If the patron donated 2500 dollars, I start at 10K, which is doubling the two times contribution. 10K, 5K, 2,500. It makes it neater, it's easier to say ten thousand dollars than seventy-five hundred dollars, and it's a bigger amount! We don't necessarily expect the patron to give that first ask amount... it's there to make the other asks seem a little more reasonable.
Additionally, the telemarketer that's calling you has been instructed not to make the call "an auction."
"You don't want to give 2,500 dollars? Then how about two thousand? Can you make it fifteen hundred? C'mon! I know you must have a thousand dollars for us!"
That's another pet peeve that patrons have about the process... constantly trying to find a number and badgering a person until they give something.
Some cagey patrons will, after we ask for ten thousand will say something like, "I won't give that but I'll give you three hundred dollars." And some of the lesser experienced telemarketers will say, "Great!" and take that amount. If you get that response, you know you're dealing with a rank amateur!
We are set to bring the conversation back to the three asks we are supposed to do, at their proper levels. So, if I get a patron who tries that move, I would thank them for the offer but remind them the need and the work that is involved in the effort and go back to the proper level ask to continue. I have lost 300, 500 and sometimes 1000 dollar sales for this, because the patron is offended that we are still asking for more than they have already offered, and they hang up. But this is what the client wants.
Now, if we get to utter our three asks and the patron still wishes to donate that 300 dollars, at that point, we would accept it graciously! But we have to at least get our asks in before settling for a smaller amount.
If the patron still doesn't want to donate after we asked for those three amounts, we have done our job! We typically thank them for taking a moment to speak with us, read any disclaimer that needs to be stated at the end of the call, and wish them a good morning/afternoon/evening. And you won't hear from us again for at least three months or more, depending on what campaign it is. Some of these fundraising efforts are annually, others like the DNC are seasonal (unless you give the maximum per calendar year - currently $32,400.00. In that case, you won't hear from us again until at least January 2nd of the following year!)
At my firm, all of our calls are recorded (and we tell our patrons so at the beginning of the call) and our clients often want to hear our calls to see if we are following their instructions, treating these people nicely, and doing our jobs properly. This is especially true for the DNC, which is held to a very high standard of protocol when it comes to asking patrons for funds. The DNC watches us intently, but we haven't disappointed them yet!
But there's your answer: a telemarketer will likely ask you three times for three separate donation amounts, before the end of the call!
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no subject
Date: 2014-02-26 06:33 pm (UTC)There are some people who call us frequently, who read from a script. They practice it, and use the right inflections and everything, but you can still tell they're reading it. It especially drives me crazy when the scripts try to be funny.
no subject
Date: 2014-02-26 09:28 pm (UTC)I'm always fascinated by
no subject
Date: 2014-02-27 12:28 am (UTC)I may be an anomaly. They start off with a ludicrous number, which feels vaguely insulting, and then I'm inclined to give even less than my normal amount.
One place that calls me, I give them $100 a year. But all at once, and they call twice a year. So sometimes $100, sometimes $0. And then they ask if I want to give $350, or whatever, and I want to say, "haven't you looked at my donation history? You're not paying attention, are you?"
But my main question is, why does the client dictate how patrons get asked? Shouldn't they leave that up to the experts who are doing the calling?
no subject
Date: 2014-02-27 04:17 am (UTC)We always say, don't be offended. We never know who can give what until we ask.
One wise guy caller used to say "We were hoping you won the lottery..." then followed it up with "I guess it didn't happen today, huh?"
Fired.
But yeah, we see your donation history sir. But we were hoping that you would make an exception, just this once, and do a thousand, just because I have a thing about round numbers (with four digits)!
Now, as you're getting your credit card, let me answer your other question. The client has some ideas about what they want to do, how they want to handle their calling lists and what sort of numbers they are expecting. They do meet with our staff, which is most important for new clients, people who either haven't worked with us before or haven't used the telephone for fundraising before.
Will that be Visa, Mastercard, American Express or Discover? I'll wait.
So, yes, they do talk with and listen to us as far as advising them on what we can do for their company. But they still are the ones to determine just what they want us to do. We are working for them, and that requires us to do things their way, even if we know it might not be the most successful way.
Thank you for your much needed contribution of a thousand dollars! Did you find that card yet?!
no subject
Date: 2014-02-27 05:09 am (UTC)I've been known to totally fall for a good sales pitch. Throwing out a crazy high number is not part of one. But I do recognize that such number can be couched in the proper context for better effect. But it seldom is.
no subject
Date: 2014-02-27 05:30 am (UTC)As for the number, we have to set it up... we need to explain the situation, what we hope to achieve this year, the work and the timing before we make that first ask. It is typically nicely wrapped with a lot of verbage about all of the stuff that is important before we get to that number!
Truth is, most telemarketing companies don't have the skill set to ask for the amounts that my company does, so they typically fail. Sometimes the DNC wants to test the waters and they hand over half of their list to another company just to see how they do against us. No other company comes close.
Everybody wants to do things their own way, even the DNC!
no subject
Date: 2014-02-27 04:07 am (UTC)We're starting a new campaign today, and we have a totally different approach because, as per, the client gets what they want. So we're not even asking 3x the usual, because they don't want to "abuse" their patrons. So be it!
But, yeah, asking high is just making the second ask reasonable by comparison, assuming they stay on the line after either getting angry or fainting.
no subject
Date: 2014-02-27 04:03 am (UTC)It's hard to really know precisely if the first ask is effective overall, since we can't compare it to "not asking" that first high ask of the patron we're calling. It would likely be different based on all the uncontrollable random factors.
It would be great to know about what scripts you're hearing and what sorts of humor they're trying to use. Like I said, most of the people writing scripts really have no clue about making it fit for the phone, so I can imagine they know even less about comedy!
no subject
Date: 2014-02-27 05:11 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-02-27 05:34 am (UTC)I try never to go negative like that, because that puts people off right away! Again, this is a person that really doesn't know what to do or say on the phone.
no subject
Date: 2014-02-27 03:24 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2014-02-28 12:27 pm (UTC)Part of the reason my company records calls is to show the clients what we're doing, but also, occasionally when things are going badly we are brought in to a meeting and the calls are played... sometimes to just us, and other times to the entire staff of callers working on that job so we can hear the bad (and examples of the good) calls made. I doubt that any of these other companies are doing that.
Truthfully, many telemarketing companies like to have high turnover. They don't want callers lagging around for 3-6 months. So they don't really care to train their callers as well as we do, and they aren't in the business of keeping callers on staff, because they don't care - but perhaps that's better explained in a separate post!
no subject
Date: 2014-02-28 02:45 pm (UTC)The company I worked for also recorded all calls, and had "real time" managers listening in to some, but from what I could tell, those calls and listen ins were only used for reprimand.